What will it cost to start making 172 bullets?

[Chickenthief]

The bare minimum to make 20 and 25 grains 172 bullets!

I can make a lead wire extruder, cutter and "sizer", no problem. Maybe a little but i have lots of time and few $$$ so i will try and test until it works.

What i need are jackets (.45-.5" long?) for 20-25gr bullets and a forming die.

I know i know i know, go to corbins, but their price list is clear as mud and almost gave me a nosebleed trying to figure out what i needed. And they dont list 17 cal jackets.

25gr Hornady V-MAX costs me $29US/100 + shipping (min. $8½US from Germany).
I will be "working" for myself and a mate but might consider selling if it pans out ok.

[Jingle]

Why not 30 grain bullets as there is a lack of them in .172?

Or maybe soft points or something with an expanding nature oppose to fragmentation.

[ray h]

One of the very best die makers frequent here, George Ulrich.

[Tilleyman]

Or maybe soft points or something with an expanding nature oppose to fragmentation.

TOTALLY... anything to save my fingers pulling hundreds of 20gr XTP controlled expansion bullets from loaded 17 HMR rounds ;)

[Chickenthief]

I'm game for anything as long as i can overcome the startup cost and break even at some distant point.
My only "real" recourse is time.

So all you smart guys how do i make controlled expansion bullets?
Are they "different" from filling a lump of lead in a jacket then form a point on it?

I have looked some at corbins www and as far as i can see a bare min startup is @ $650, is that about it? But under .224 it is custom charge wich is what?

Then i need another $250 forming die every time i change bullet shape?

The only way to "loose" money faster than this is starting my own NASCAR team!

[Mntngoat]

carbide dies will cost you about 2x what Corbin quoted. and you need a quality press, then you need jackets. Length is dependant on weight desired.

ML

[Oleman]

Talk with George Ulrich.

[reed1911]

Minimum you need the press to handle it and be accurate enough, you can convert a good solid cast iron press for this provided you have the capability or have a local machine shop do it or buy one. Jackets can be bought or drawn from .22 cal jackets I would buy them from J4 rather than Corbins.com. Lead is lead so long as it is pure or close to it. The wire extrude, cutter, and core size dies are as you noted rather easy to make. Then you are really only left with the core seat, point form, and if so wanted the lead tip die. You can use those same dies for an array of weights, nose will be the same of course. You likely will also want a jacket size/ trim die if you are sizing down from .22 cal jackets, and you may want one even if you use proper .17 cal jackets as when you need shorter jackets for lighter weights you often don't want or need the excess hollow jacket. you should be able to make those two dies as well, if you need help for ideas just ask, lots of good folks here.

[george ulrich]

actually your probably better drawing from 20 cal if you use 22 cal jacket becomes to thick. It sounds like funding might be an issue, and steel dies are not a problem to you so you might also consider Larry Blackman

[Chickenthief]

I think this bost sunk before it even set sail!

Berger wont sell jackets.

But thanks to all for the effort http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm153/Chickenthief/Blandet/Smilere/wav.gif (http://s295.photobucket.com/user/Chickenthief/media/Blandet/Smilere/wav.gif.html)

[Oleman]

I think you're giving up too easy other suppliers show the J-4 jackets in stock and for sale.

[iiranger]

Dave Corbin is the "big wind" with lots of books and other information and he deserves compensation for his efforts...Others are not as vocal and charge less.

Dave Corbin, corbins.com, swage.com, bulletswage.com, etc.

Dave has a brother, Richard, who went off on his own some time back. Rich can be reached at rceco.com.

Actually as my machinist buddy told me, any machine shop can do this sort of work but the USA FFL (Federal Firearms License) discourages shops that don't have one. No one wants government trouble. VERY hard on profits. Developement time can cost too. Getting proper hardening takes experience too.

Another source, BSS, (Bullet Swaging Supply) of Louisana. Mr. Larry Blackmon. Very limited web page.

Needless to say, none of this is, usually, on the shelf stuff. And most have a surcharge for the undersized, .17 and .20 and .19 and ...

Many, including Hornady and Speer (actually as partners at the very beginning) got started making .224 bullets out of fired rimfire cases. How hot do you want to go with your 17? Rimfire jacket fails much past 3200 fps per Corbin.

RCBS, "Big Green" began as "Rock Chuckers Bullet Swages" for making .22 fired cases into bullets... You need a good press. This small, less good.

Richard C. has jackets. As does Brunoshooters supply. They are "war material" and exporting is a can of worms in itself. Richard won't. BSS has pistol jackets. Very limited rifle.

Yes, you need a different point form die to form a different shape front end. Core swage can be same as core seat can too.

With the sub .22's I would be inclined to go with a 2 or 3 s nose. Blunt is another word. Your big velocity loss is going to be to air resistance but the long pointed bullets don't have any mass to perserve it, so why? Jack O'Connor wrote that at the time the .257 Roberts was developed as a target cartridge, they did not know how to make accurate pointed bullets, thus its standard round nosed bullet... !!

You can also "size down" larger bullets. .20's available? This small, you might want to look into a small lathe (jewelry supply houses), SUPER safety glasses, and brass rod. Copper rod. Turn the little beggers. Luck. Happy Trails. :D

[vmthtr in Green Bay]

You can forget BSS, or Blackmon. Friend called him a short time ago and is NOT accepting new orders, he is backlogged for a long time. Friend makes 30 cal bullets on 1" j4 jackets and cannot get them. Good luck