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  #1  
Old 03-16-2011, 10:26 PM
Drumie Drumie is offline
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Default New reloader with a few questions

I just got into reloading over the winter. Just starting up with the 17 Remington Fireball. I worked up a bunch of loads with the 27gr golds and 25gr Woodchuck den bullets. Well my custom Remington 700 with a Lilja barrel on it didn't like the 27gr at all. Looked more like a pattern then a group. It did like the 25gr a lot though. Seems it grouped just as good with Benchmark as it did with H322. Ok so here is the problem I am having. I am getting primer craters with this gun now. I don't remember it doing it before but it did it with factory loads and with my handloads. How much should I worry about it? Here are some pics of it.




On the left is 17.4 gr of H322 in the center is a factory round and on the left is 18.3gr of H322.

Also it looks like my primers are flattening out. I am using CCI 400 primers. It looked like they would flatten out right away with a light load. The bolt lift was fine, wasn't hard at all. How do these loads look to you guys?
Here is pics of the primer


Factory primer on left, CCI 400 on right



Also how much should I worry about pressure with these loads? I tested them in 45 degree weather and plan on shooting them up to about 80 degree.
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  #2  
Old 03-16-2011, 11:28 PM
Chuck Miller Chuck Miller is offline
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Default craters

I'm assuming you have a factory Rem 700, ignore them and continue on. Looking at your pics the shoulders of your primers are still rounded, the craters are because of the excessive size of the fireingpin hole. Unless it's an issue that you just can't live with, and if it is, then send your bolt to Gretan. He's making a living off bushing Rem 700 bolts. I once accused him of teaming up with Remington to get the bushing biz. What you need to be aware of is when your primer is cratered, flattened out to the edge, bolt is hard to lift when extracting a fired case, scuff marks on the case face. My guess in looking at your pics you have none of these issues?

Last edited by Chuck Miller; 03-16-2011 at 11:57 PM.
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  #3  
Old 03-16-2011, 11:49 PM
ab_bentley ab_bentley is offline
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Chuck hit the nail, sloppy pin hole. Also what twist is that barrel? I am really supprised it would stabilize the 25's and not the 27's.
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Old 03-17-2011, 01:57 AM
GrdhgKiller GrdhgKiller is offline
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Default As far as accuracy with the 27's

Do you know where your lands are in relationship to each bullet. I don't like to jam bullets into the lands in case I have to extract a round. However I can usually find an accurate load with the bullet somewhere between .005" to .030" off the lands. Have you tried this with the 27 grainers.
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  #5  
Old 03-17-2011, 08:05 AM
jwv2001 jwv2001 is offline
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Change to either a magnum or a BR primer, both have a thicker primer cup.
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  #6  
Old 03-17-2011, 11:10 AM
Drumie Drumie is offline
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Thanks guys. I thought it wasn't anything to worry about. But I just wanted some other opinions. It is a factory Remington bolt. The Barrel is a Lilja 1-9 twist. I was susprised that it didn't like the 27gr. I have had 3 different factory 17FB and none of them would shoot the factory 25gr rounds. But this one when I got it back from being built would shoot the factory 25gr and 20gr into the same hole at 100 yards. I am not sure how far off the lands the bullets are. Do you think it would make a difference? Like I said the "groups" with the 27gr were about 4-6 inches at 100 yards. I will probally send out the bolt later in the year to have it looked at. It is getting about time to shoot some woodchucks now and I don't want to be with out this gun. Do you guys have Gretans info?
thanks again.
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  #7  
Old 03-17-2011, 04:24 PM
Chuck Miller Chuck Miller is offline
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Default Gretan

Here's his info, service is lightening quick. Not surprised that the 17FB is not shooting the heavies well, sometimes you just need plain speed to stabilize these or at least get them to shoot. I have a 17-223AI with a Lilja 1-9 and it prefers the 27-30gr pills, actually it's the only 17 1-9 that I have that does. It's also shooting them close to 4K fps.

http://www.gretanrifles.com/

Last edited by Chuck Miller; 03-17-2011 at 04:27 PM.
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  #8  
Old 03-17-2011, 05:13 PM
17varminter 17varminter is offline
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Default

I have the Model 7 rifles in 17 FB and they shot Kindlers' 30gr and Gunhaus 32gr bullets very well.
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  #9  
Old 03-21-2011, 02:32 AM
Stephen Perry Stephen Perry is offline
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Default Drumie

Lots of opinions here some with merit. My take is as a new reloader you haven't mastered the art of fire-forming your brass properly. Shoot what you have now but cratering is generally caused by not fire-forming brass properly and thus not creating a correct headspaced shoulder.

Next time when you start with new brass or once fired that only has the intial fire-forming remember what I said in an earlier Post. Fire-form twice no oil using powders that both times create maximum pressure but keep things safe. The first fire-forming matches the case to the chamber the second fire-forming works on the shoulder. A properly fire-formed case will seal the chamber, require minmum resizing to work on the case taper, and will eventually push the shoulder foreward a couple thousandths with several firings prompting a die adjustment to push back the shoulder those couple thousandths to facilitate good bolt operation.

What you have done with your current brass is that have created several false shoulders from bad fire-forming. Lots of reloaders have your problem until they increase pressure in fire-forming brass. I would say not all your cases show cratered primers. Do a little reading on fire-forming in a good reloading manual.

Stephen Perry
Angeles BR

Last edited by Stephen Perry; 03-21-2011 at 07:54 AM.
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  #10  
Old 03-21-2011, 02:53 AM
ab_bentley ab_bentley is offline
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He's using factory 17FB brass and can't use the flase shoulder like he could if forming from 221 or other brass. Adam
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