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  #1  
Old 06-21-2007, 10:58 PM
ussniper ussniper is offline
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Default 17 remington prob

Hello all first post. I recently picked up a Remington 700 vs in a heavy barrel 17. I've tried varget with the 30 gr bergers, and also benchmark with the same bullet. Now I'm not new to reloading by no means, but this is the finikiest rifle I own. I cant get much better than 2 to 3" groups at 100yds. I've tried 5000ths off the rifling to 15,000ths off the rifling. should I start somewhere else off the rifling? Does anyone else have a load withe these powders they would be willing to share. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I'm at wits end with this thing. Thanks.....ussniper
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  #2  
Old 06-22-2007, 12:47 AM
Johnly Johnly is offline
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I have a pair of older M700 17 remingtons, and they shoot much better than the results you are getting. If your current bullet choice is 30 grain Bergers (which ought to shoot well) I'd try 25.0 gr. of H380, as that shoots well in my rifles. It's not super fast, about 3500 fps, but it's worth a try. Some people have had good results with AA2700 and H414/WW760 with the 30 grain bullets. IMR 4320 and 4064 are also excellent 17 Remington powders with 25 and 30 grain bullets.

John in Oregon




Quote:
Originally Posted by ussniper View Post
Hello all first post. I recently picked up a Remington 700 vs in a heavy barrel 17. I've tried varget with the 30 gr bergers, and also benchmark with the same bullet. Now I'm not new to reloading by no means, but this is the finikiest rifle I own. I cant get much better than 2 to 3" groups at 100yds. I've tried 5000ths off the rifling to 15,000ths off the rifling. should I start somewhere else off the rifling? Does anyone else have a load withe these powders they would be willing to share. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I'm at wits end with this thing. Thanks.....ussniper
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  #3  
Old 06-22-2007, 03:28 AM
Bryce Bryce is offline
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Best groups of 2 - 3 inches out of a heavy barreled varmint rifle suggests to me that there is something fundamentally wrong rather than a simple case of a load tweaking being needed to get it right !!

I'd suggest that you try the 25 grain Berger. I don't know what twist the rifle is but it might just be a bullet stability issue. The 25 grain Berger will shoot well even shot slow out of a 10 twist so is a nice safe bet.

I used the Moly 25 Berger and 23.3 grains of Benchmark with a CCI BR4 primer. That load shot well and did a very respectable 4050fps.

That all assumes a clean barrel free from fouling. With any 17 inaccuracy problem, especially a factory barrel, you can never not mention keeping the barrel appropriately clean, some people overstate the whole thing but they do need to be looked after better than say a 223.
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Old 06-22-2007, 01:36 PM
JoeZ JoeZ is offline
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Default Did you check the crown?

I would also run threw the screws to make sure everything is tight and check your twist as Bryce mentioned. Most of my sweet spots for the 17s are between 10-20thou. Maybe another bullet. My gun did not really care for 20V-maxs but it loves 20 Nagles. The 25gr V-max shoots really good, so do the 25gr Bergers. H414 and H380 are also good powders for the Rem with the heavy bullets. Check your run out also. Dies and bedding were the reason I was getting 2 inch patterns. My loads are Benchmark and N-133. N-133 start at around 20.5 grains with a 25, I am getting wicked velocity and 1/2inch accuracy, with N-133, benchmark and 25gr bullets.
N-135 might be another powder choice. Lee manual has about the most loads. It is one of the cheaper ones also.
There is nothing worse than fighting a rifle. It will shot once you find out what it likes. Keep us posted.
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  #5  
Old 06-23-2007, 12:16 AM
chris allen chris allen is offline
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Default 17 rem

I don't want to seem smart but has the barrel been scrubbed and cleaned .Over the years I have purchased many Rem .700 in 17 Rem, I believe that I have gotten them because the did not shoot well and the only reason they did not shoot any more is they were extremely dirty.I cleaned them and they shot fine.Part of the problem is proper cleaning rods for 17 cal. were and can be hard to find .

Good luck,
Chris
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  #6  
Old 06-23-2007, 12:38 AM
ussniper ussniper is offline
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Thanks for all the replies and help. I've had the rifle for about 6 months (brand new) it's a 700 vs, alluminum piller bedded from factory with a McMillen stock. All test rounds were with 5 shot groups and cleaned spotless after each group with shooters choice and kroil. I have the other three rifles that are identical except for caliber and there absolute tac drivers. This is the only rifle that has ever gave me this much of a headache . I've gone from 5,000 to 15,000ths off the rifling. I personally dont think the rifle likes me . Once again thank for all the info, for now its back to the drawing board again....I'll keep ya posted....Oh the twist of barrel is a 1 in 9....Jason
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  #7  
Old 06-23-2007, 11:02 PM
StevenD StevenD is offline
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Default My 17 Rem is pretty finicky as well. (long)

I just got a 17 Rem custom and have had a dickens of a time getting it tuned to where I think it should be able to perform. However, out to 3 shot groups, I was able to keep them respectable. 5 shot groups started to open up. I am still trying to eliminate the occasional flier (perhaps a lofty goal), but this is what I found to help:

1. Check the cases for consistency and either weigh them or check the volume. I found a significant difference in the Remington cases. The quality was really poor in the lot of brass that I received. For small volume cases, that can be a significant difference in pressure.

2. I had to sort bullets, partly because I am shooting 37 gn VLD's, which is a total story unto itself. I have a tighter twist barrel and it has been an adventure. I checked bullets for weight and found them to be pretty good that way, but also for length to the ogive. I found some variance in the distance from the ogive to the rifling lands. Again, this can confound consistency/accuracy.

3. When working up loads, I defined a curve relating velocity to powder charge. When I found a spot where the velocities tended to group, though the variance in the powder charge might be on the order of +/- 0.01 grains, I chose the median of that cluster for a trial load. I worked to get as much consistency out of that load as possible before going to something else.

4. My barrel has to be cleaned very often. I usually scrub it reasonably clean every 15 shots. Otherwise, accuracy goes south on me real quick. I have heard that this is due to the difference in the lands and grooves being on the order of about 1/2 of rifles of larger calibers. Therefore, carbon fouling in can fill the crevices much quicker with the 17 calibers.

My goal now is to check a 1st shot group (cold barrel only). My rifle is mostly for coyotes and the like. The first shot is the most critical for me. When I am settled on that, I will chronograph the difference between the 1st and 2nd and 3rd shots to see what happens to me at longer ranges.

I did find the Kindler Gold 30 grain bullets to work well in my rifle. I also found those bullets to be more consistent than the 37 gn VLD's which is not too surprising when one compares the 2 bullets side-by-side.

Anyway, if you want more specifics, let me know via a P.M. or something. I can send you some things to show you what I have been up against.
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  #8  
Old 06-24-2007, 12:53 AM
tuck2 tuck2 is offline
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I have two of my Remington rifles given a tune up. Some times glass bedding the action , free floating the barrel, adjusting the trigger down to 2 3/4 Lbs,and haveing the bolt locking lugs lapped, and the muzzle recrowned have improved the accuracy of the rifles. On one rifle only one locking lug showed any wear and the best groups were about 3 inches, after having the lugs lapped it shot groups under one inch. The other rifle shot smaller groups after glass bedding, free floating the barrel and adjusting the trigger. I have an other rifle that shot larger groups after I got a flat mark on the muzzle.
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  #9  
Old 06-25-2007, 10:41 PM
Chuck Miller Chuck Miller is offline
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Default Same rifle

I've got the same rifle, Rem 700 VS, and it shoots the same 3-5" groups. Nothing's wrong with the crown, barrels clean, tried Bergers, and Nagles 20/25/30's and still it doesn't shoot for spit. It's heading up to Kevin Weaver for a barrel transplant, same caliber and twist 17cal - 1-9, just a premium barrel this time. Been down this road before, a rifle that's going to clean up and shoot doesn't throw 3-5" groups, 1-2" maybe, but not shotgun patterns.
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  #10  
Old 06-28-2007, 11:05 AM
LT17 LT17 is offline
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I have to say I love the 17 Remington but it has caused me a lot of grief getting one to shoot well. I also use 25gr of H380 with the 30gr Berger but actually get better groups now with 25gr Hornady hp's and Winchester 748.

I would be surprised if the load was the cause of the relatively poor groups since you are not new to loading. The 17's do seem to be finicky, but I think as Bryce suggests there may something more fundamental that is causing this problem.
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