17 k hornet

[Alan in GA]

One thing that did not occur when a group of us sat around and 'spec'd a new 17 Ackley Hornet reamer. In an effort to reduce or eliminate case wall 'bulge' just above the rim, we measured a bunch of NEW brass 22 Hornet cases of Winchester make, our brand of choice based on our experience with it.
We found two general sizes and assumed the cases from several bags of 100 each must have been made on two separate dies. With these new case measurements, a 17AH reamer spec sheet was drawn and submitted and a live pilot reamer made. We did the same with 17 Mach IV reamer.

What a person CAN run into is a chamber that makes great looking fired cases with minimal or 'no' bulge that can be detected by the eye. Great, should make for many reloads.
However........ : I ...you can also depart from the ability to be able to use 'standard' factory reloading dies for full length resizing of 'other' fired cases. Factory dies are made to SAAMI specs, and we had fired cases that if fired in another rifle with a 'standard' chamber, could not be SIZED SMALL ENOUGH to fit in our 'no bulge' chambers!
17AH ammo rarely [never?] needs FL sizing in my experience unless you are loading UP to see how much 1680 powder your little 17 caliber pills can be fired over. Then even the thin walled Hornet cases will need FL sizing.
For any 'other hornet cases' we might want to fire in our 'no bulge' chambers, such as the fired cases from our rifles made with my first 17AH reamer which is more generous and 'bulge' making, we HAD TO make a BODY DIE out of some die stock. This was more necessary with 17 Mach IV cases as many were made from fired 221 cases coming from other rifles.

SO.....perfection might be to make a 'spec reamer' on the minimal side, but maybe not so small you are faced with making body dies or ordering custom dies. I have a 17AH reamer that cuts a chamber that allows almost 9 thousanths expansion at the neck. Allows a slight bulge as well. But the fired cases I have never, or almost never crack at the neck which is worked so much. They crack at the shoulder if at all~!

Just an FYI that in the goal of trying to reach MINIMAL dimensions in attention to body bulge, one can 'minimize' too far for standard reloading die sets. If you want custom dies and I'm sure some of us have gone that route, no problem. But now it won't be a surprise to anyone reading this.
: )

[hemiallen]

Excellent point.


I purchased one of those " tight chambered" 17AH and as it was my first foray in a 22 Hornet based cartridge I learned fast. I called Mr Weaver and he agree'd with my findings, trying to use once-fired cases was a no-no, the reamer was designed for new hornet brass which all I could find at the time to fit was WW, as Rem was too big.

While I was anxious to reload for the gun, I ended up taking a hardened 7/8-14 SHCS and drilled, then bored the center threaded end to reform the "once fired-oversized" brass so it would allow me to close the bolt. That was , and still is, while WW 22 hornet brass is like Hen's teeth.


I am now, actually will be once deer season is finished, ready to form Prvi 22 Hornet brass down to fit my 17 HH CZ rifle(s) and once those are completed I'll be ready to do more work on the 17AH, if another TOY doesn't get in the way, LOL.


Allen

[rick w.]

I really do not know much about the 17HH factory offering, but in a quick looksee at some of the posted reamer drawings, the 17HH looks bigger in diameter in general than the typical 17 hornet wildcats. So I think that Daryl's comment is well taken. Guess one could take a guess(mathematical slide) along the body of the case, and do a best estimate at what would happen assuming a constant taper of case, if one might so bold. One of the considerations would be metal/wood fit on the forearm section of said firearm after "rechambering". I cannot comment very heavily on rechambering myself other than glittering generalities, as mentioned earlier, aftermarket blanks have spoiled me. I do have a large selection of mandrels though.

Perfection in wildcats takes money and time and effort. I have found over the years there is always some compromise to be made for some gain; jousting with windmills is still the same after all these years.

I suspect that if one knows enough to spec an undersized reamer, then those same folks probably took a looksee at how to size and load the cartridges, but I am a dreamer. Fitted parts are fitted parts.

I was not aware of any of the Ackleys or K's in the SAAMI charts, but will take another looksee, perhaps some empirical info with a limited set of reamers and/or case types; to quote specs specifically, I never was able to do, when I thought I could, I got it in the neck.

The reamer grinders do sell matched sets of chamber reamers and sizing die reamers, each costs the same, a reamer is a reamer to them. On my limited rendition into the 17 hornet world, I did not try to reinvent the wheel; but only used what I found here on the forum and what PTG offered. Seems to work ok for me and my limited resources here, and "works" is a relative term I have to admit. Also admit I am not in the high pressure/faster group.

I am reminded of the Eastwood phrase, you have to know your limitations....which I think is done best in person with said specific articles.

So experimentation is; I think, a good thing. If we never made a mistake, that kinda would be sorta boring to me; knowledge is based on mistakes to a degree.

Lots of variables in wildcats, too many for me to quote exacting numbers to turn to, size to, load to................but of course those variables are the spice of life to a wildcater.

[Daryl]

" ALAN - 17AH ammo rarely [never?] needs FL sizing in my experience unless you are loading UP to see how much 1680 powder your little 17 caliber pills can be fired over. Then even the thin walled Hornet cases will need FL sizing."

my findings exactly, however - even the 3,925fps 20gr. Vmax & 3,640fps W/Lil'Gun and 25gr. Vmax loads with AA1680 need only normal neck sizing in my Wilson arbor press dies.

[Alycidon]

I found that 17AH does not feed well even with a single shot follower. Think it has a 40 deg shoulder.

Was going to re chamber down to a 30 degree shoulder to make it feed, at present the shoulder hangs up on the end of the chamber when loose fed on the follower. Been intending to do that for a couple of years but not got around to it yet.

A

[Alan in GA]

Originally Posted by Alycidon

I found that 17AH does not feed well even with a single shot follower. Think it has a 40 deg shoulder.

Was going to re chamber down to a 30 degree shoulder to make it feed, at present the shoulder hangs up on the end of the chamber when loose fed on the follower. Been intending to do that for a couple of years but not got around to it yet.

A

See if your bolt face is smooth enough. I've used a couple of different single shot followers [blocks] that work well. Calhoun's, and several home made ones from Delrin for different CZ 527's.

[Daryl]

Originally Posted by Alycidon

I found that 17AH does not feed well even with a single shot follower. Think it has a 40 deg shoulder.

Was going to re chamber down to a 30 degree shoulder to make it feed, at present the shoulder hangs up on the end of the chamber when loose fed on the follower. Been intending to do that for a couple of years but not got around to it yet.

A

.17 AH has a 30 degree shoulder - the .17Khornet version, like the .22 "K" Hornet, is 35 degrees.

My follower feeds the .17AH's perfectly it's made of a piece of spruce glued into the magazine mortise. Throw in a round and it chambers perfectly.

I'm sure I've seen guys here write that the delrin SS flowers they bought from Calhoun worked well too.

You may have to do some alteration to get it to work- a dremil tool with a rotary bit will help.

The shoulder hitting the end of the barrel sounds as if the front of the follower is too low, or the hollowed section is nor properly positioned to angle the front of the round into the chamber. Perfectly done, an empty case should chamber, but a loaded one should chamber perfectly.

edited